Planned Parenthood spies on you
Posted by Matt Yonke on Tuesday, June 24th, 2008
Last Saturday, June 20, saw another showing of the incredible level of commitment of Aurora's pro-life community. Over 120 pro-lifers came out to Planned Parenthood Aurora at 9 a.m. to tell the world that they will not rest till abortion is out of Aurora.
Weather started out beautiful, probably the best weather we've seen at one of our monthly protests, but went south quickly when dark clouds showed up on the horizon. Soon sprinkles gave way to an outright downpour, drenching the activists.
But even torrential rains couldn't the dampen the spirits of the faithful protesters. They marched and prayed and sang and chanted all the way up to the scheduled end time of 10:30 a.m.
Was it coincidence, then, that two days after tenth huge monthly protest at Planned Parenthood, they've once again beefed up their security in an attempt to harass and intimidate pro-lifers, especially our stalwart sidewalk counselors and prayer warriors.
These huge ugly cameras are pointed directly at where our sidewalk counselors stand and are clearly there so that they can gather evidence to prosecute anyone who so much as looks at their property.
Planned Parenthood exhibits such an odd fear of the grandmothers and teenagers, dads on their lunch break and moms with their young children who give up their time to offer hope to women in crisis. Why should they be afraid of this harmless, peaceful, prayerful group?
The Truth. That's the only reason why a billion dollar multi-national corporation like Planned Parenthood would ever be afraid of a group of citizens praying on the sidewalk. We have the truth they don't want their customers to know, because when abortion-bound moms realize what's actually happening in their wombs, Planned Parenthood loses customers.
So take heart pro-lifers. When Goliath starts to get nervous, David's doing something right.
I see. But taking down license plate numbers of patients is NOT harassment? PP has this security in place because of the history of the PL movement where doctors are KILLED, clinics are BOMBED, and patients are repeatedly harassed. So, yes, of course, they want security cameras to make sure that the PLers stay off their property!
June 24th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Uh huh….that's it. The "truth" is why they put in bulletproof windows.
June 24th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
But they already HAVE cameras all around the building! They have them pointed at us already! They already have bullet-proof glass and 9 inch thick precast concrete walls!
And look at the cameras themselves. Their other cameras are aesthetically pleasing cameras that blend in with the building. The new ones are huge monstrosities that were clearly chosen to draw attention and intimidate.
It must be nice to have money to burn! I don't want to hear another word about how much government funding the need when they go pulling stunts like this.
June 24th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
How is it harassment for PP to use cameras, yet you guys are obviously pointing cameras at the clinic AND at patients?? What sort of evidence are YOU attempting to gather??
June 24th, 2008 at 4:15 pm
Are you doing something you don't want on tape?
June 24th, 2008 at 7:51 pm
"Are you doing something you don't want on tape?"
I think I'm going to bring my tap shoes with while I councel and make use of those cameras! A little soft shoe, prayer and kind words of real help:)
June 24th, 2008 at 8:50 pm
I'm sure you're aware that you cannot be legally prosecuted for "looking" at property. If you are doing something illegal the tape could be used in court as evidence. However, if you're not doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about.
This is very similar situation to the library double standard. Many of you folks don't want your kids to see the Teenwire website but don't really care if others of us object to your graphic photos being forced on our children. In the case at hand, you object to the use of cameras by PP but virtually do the same thing yourself by photographing patients and their license plates.
June 24th, 2008 at 9:13 pm
That might not be such a bad idea, Karen! I think that while many of the protestors have good intentions and actually care about the women entering Planned Parenthood, the bloody signs and angry shouts coming from other protestors are intimidating and probably send patients running for the shelter of the clinic. A little humor might make you guys more approachable.
I know I would be more likely to take pro life protestors seriously if they showed a little more friendliness and a little less vitriol and self-rightousness!
June 24th, 2008 at 9:16 pm
I can't remember the last time I wasn't friendly:)
I love Our Lord so much I want to show His love to all, and most especially when I counsel. And I can honestly say I have not witnessed any other counselor or even protestor not do the same.
June 24th, 2008 at 9:28 pm
You pro-abortion people never cease to amaze me… oy
June 24th, 2008 at 9:52 pm
As for the "signs" I hate them too!! They make me cry every time I see them. But I believe they will and are awakening a people here in America who have been asleep at the wheel. Abortion is a silent holocaust precisely because no one is made to see the horrific reality of abortion.
Don’t worry too much about the children seeing the pictures, they have and will become our greatest heroes fighting this war for life. Just as the children at Fatima were protected when they were allowed to see Hell, so it is with the hellish pictures of those dear babies who were torn apart by their very own species, human beings, where is the love in that?
June 24th, 2008 at 9:54 pm
"you … virtually do the same thing yourself by photographing patients and their license plates."
Is this really happening at the PP in Aurora? I tend to doubt it, but I've been wrong before.
June 24th, 2008 at 10:18 pm
Brian,
Yes, it is really happening.
June 25th, 2008 at 7:31 am
Don't worry too much about teens seeing Teenwire then. Why do you think it's acceptable that you control what your child sees while you deny me the same right?
June 25th, 2008 at 7:55 am
Thats the whole point,they don't want to only control what their children see but have taken it upon themselves to control what everyone sees.If they would get counseling for their control issues then maybe they would learn to leave everone to make their own choices for themselves and their own children.As for the cameras,why are you so concerned about it if what your doing is causing no problems then…….?If your not harrassing people then………?
June 25th, 2008 at 9:00 am
My comment does not seem to want to post, probably because of multiple links. I'll try again with just one.
Brian, these photos were taken at the Planned Parenthood in Aurora:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/plal/2274879589/in/set-72157603938145859/
Notice the photo credit.
June 25th, 2008 at 9:18 am
Also this one:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/plal/2274870461/in/set-72157603938145859/
June 25th, 2008 at 9:18 am
You are comparing apples to oranges when you compare the exposing of abortion, showing the end result of an abortion, example; the decapitated baby picture, and Teen wire; where they teach a very crude, disgusting, lustful, warped, perverted idea of sex. Ones objective in showing the baby pictures is to correct an evil that is going on. Teen Wire is encouraging and condoning a warped sense of sexuality. The only thing they may have in common is that Teen wire helps to contribute to many more tore apart babies in our country. If you think Planned Parenthood created Teen Wire because they care about preventing abortion then you are blind. They make huge amounts of money doing abortions. What company would try and limit there service? They wouldn't! The more service the more money! If Teen Wire helps to prevent abortions they would get rid of in a blink of an eye! Now you are not going to agree, because you believe wrong is right and right is wrong. That is where are country has gone, a Godless country, a "make up your own rules country." And as we go along making up these rules, we must try and include most people’s "opinions." so it will let them live the way they wish.
Without God at the center of everything you cannot see what is really right and wrong. It is like a child without a parent or anyone telling them what is right or wrong. The "kids" would just do what they wanted and other kids would tell them they instead are right, can you imagine the chaos? We need God, whether you believe it or not.But I do have to say one thing though,that I think most kids would agree on, is that killing the baby that is growing in a mother's womb is wrong. I have already been told this by many children, they just can't believe this is done in our world, they ask me if the police know about this, and why aren't they doing something about it.
June 25th, 2008 at 10:09 am
That is your opinion and everyone has one.You are entitled to that.However you try to force your opinion on people and that is just wrong.Whether right or wrong you should just back off and live your own life and let us live ours however we choose.That is why I am pro choice,because too many people stick their nose in other peoples business and try to make their choices for them.Life is full of choices and we need to make them ourselves.If you don't like a web site,don't go there.Just like a food you don't like don't eat it,song you don't like don't listen.You can't change things just because you don't think it's right or because it goes against your religion.Not everyone has your beliefs and you can preach all you want and protest all you want but you cannot change the fact that people have sex and will get pregnant and terminate their pregnancy for a variety of reasons because they all have the freedom of choice.Like it or not thats just how it is.You should not try to eliminate any source of information on protection and prevention based solely on your belief that it is sinnful.You should be glad that their is ANY form of birth control considering how you feel about abortion.
June 25th, 2008 at 10:37 am
"This is very similar to the library double standard. Many of you folks don't want your kids to see the Teenwire website but don't really care if others of us object to your graphic photos being forced on our children."
There is no double standard here. The graphic photos are essentially a visual documentation of man's inhumanity to man, much like the images of war wounded and dead. The failure of major media outlets to give fair and balanced coverage to the abortion issue, and their failure to show the reality of what happens when an unborn child's development is ended by an abortion necessitates the legal actions of those who are trying to bring an end to this holocaust. It has often been said a picture is worth a thousand words. As far as I know the taxpayer is not subsidizing these photos.
Teenwire, on the other hand, is a cleverly packaged marketing tool of Planned Parenthood Inc. The taxpayer is subsidizing Planned Parenthood and the taxpayer is also paying the bills for the Batavia library. So in this situation Batavia taxpayers get hit not once, which is bad enough, but twice. Furthermore, we actually do care very much about what kids are exposed to, especially for those facing the ultimate violence of destruction within the womb.
If those who are opposed to the display of these pictures want it to stop, one way to do that is to write their congressmen and women. Tell them of the horrors of abortion and press them to make it illegal.
June 25th, 2008 at 10:40 am
MKeller,
Those are pictures from our protests at Planned Parenthood where pictures get taken of a lot of things in an attempt to document the event. It's not as if people are out there with cameras every day trying to intimidate people.
In fact, we had trouble with a rogue activist when Planned Parenthood first opened in Aurora who was doing that and we asked him to stop, which eventually he did.
We do everything we can to make our presence there as non-threatening as we can. We're not there to scare anyone. You know our goal as well as anyone else: to offer abortion-bound women help and options.
Intimidation is an impediment to us achieving our goal. It is a strong help to Planned Parenthood in achieving theirs.
June 25th, 2008 at 11:10 am
Oh, and I must compliment you on your commitment to searching our archives! I couldn't find another picture in there with a license plate or a Planned Parenthood customer!
June 25th, 2008 at 11:16 am
Those are pictures from our protests at Planned Parenthood where pictures get taken of a lot of things in an attempt to document the event. It's not as if people are out there with cameras every day trying to intimidate people.
The subjects of those photos don't exactly look as though they are participating in your protest. Why did you feel the need to document their presence at the clinic, Matt?
June 25th, 2008 at 11:24 am
Also, what was the purpose of posting those photos on the Internet, if not to embarass or humiliate the women in them, or intimidate potential patients?
June 25th, 2008 at 11:29 am
As I said, we take lots of pictures of lots of things. What motivated those two particular shots, I couldn't tell you. Although I don't have any idea what that woman in the second link you put up is doing or where she is. Not enough context in the shot.
Regardless, I think a cursory search of our archives shows that this is not "our thing".
I think you have us confused with people like Neal Horsely, founder of the now apparently defunct "abortioncam.com" where he took pictures of abortion clinic patrons and posted them online to humiliate them.
I think a fair reading of what we do bears out that this is not the ethos of the pro-lifers operating in the Fox Valley.
June 25th, 2008 at 11:33 am
After our protests, we put up all the pictures we take in a big batch. Don't typically examine them very closely.
They're there so if people are looking for pictures of our group or what we do, we don't have to root through our archives and send them some, they can just go to flickr and use what they like.
June 25th, 2008 at 11:36 am
No, I'm not comparing apples and oranges. In both cases, the question is about what children are being exposed to. You don't want yours exposed to Teenwire and I don't want mine exposed to your photos. That IS NOT apples and oranges. I, along with many others, believe Teenwire is a good resource. You don't and I can accept that.
And I think your objective in showing those photos is to shock — and that's fine. You are legally entitled to do that. However, I find it highly inappropriate for you to decide that it's ok to show that to my children. Conversely, I believe Teenwire gives healthy, accurate information.
And that's just it — YOU don't get to decide what is right and wrong for everyone. Not everyone wants to live in a theocracy.
June 25th, 2008 at 12:16 pm
Yes, there is. One is a website that teens may visit if they'd like. The other is forced in the faces of children who are unable to avoid them.
June 25th, 2008 at 12:21 pm
Matt,
EVERY time I've been at PP I have had my picture taken. Why is this being done if not to intimidate?
June 25th, 2008 at 12:22 pm
Student,
I don't mean to pry, but were you volunteering at PP when you had your picture taken? Those safety green vests do attract attention.
If not, I don't know why you had your picture taken, but look at our websites, we don't display pictures of abortion-bound women, do we?
We don't take pictures to intimidate PP customers and we discourage people who do from doing so.
June 25th, 2008 at 1:06 pm
Matt,
It's a reasonable question and I don't mind answering. Yes, most of the photos were taken when I was working as an escort. Others were taken when I was returning from Starbacks and another was taken when I picked up a friend. God knows how many pics you have of my license plate. Other than for intimidation purposes, I have no idea why they were taken.
June 25th, 2008 at 3:13 pm
Student, you said: “No, I'm not comparing apples and oranges. In both cases, the question is about what children are being exposed to. You don't want yours exposed to Teenwire and I don't want mine exposed to your photos. That IS NOT apples and oranges. I, along with many others, believe Teenwire is a good resource. You don't and I can accept that.”
First, I think you would agree that tax dollars fund the public library in question. Yet, tax payer dollars do not pay for the displays outside the school – apples and oranges.
Second, is the potential for view point discrimination should the library choose against publishing a link that offers an alternative, yet factual, point of view on the health, sexuality, and pregnancy issue. E.g. AO
June 25th, 2008 at 4:00 pm
There's a difference between the few pro-lifers who are engaging in the type of irresponsible activity of photographing folks walking into the clinic, and these cameras that PP has set up directly facing the spot where the counselors stand.
It's clear from Mr. Yonke's responses in this thread that FAPP opposes any intimidating/threatening behavior on the part of any pro-lifers outside the clinic. Planned Parenthood however, funded this behavior with these cameras.
Let's take a step back and see this for what it is… they put up cameras that weren't originally intended in the plans. They obviously don't need them, as they have already been successful having arrested one of the pro-lifers after the police saw the video from the pre-existing cameras. So unless they expect our behavior as a movement (not individuals) to inconsistently be different than it has been for eleven months, then it is reasonable to assume that the new cameras are for intimidation purposes.
June 25th, 2008 at 5:52 pm
New website…
a SendBarackYourBaby.com.
Mike
June 25th, 2008 at 9:00 pm
How about re-aiming those camera's outside of Planned Parenthood inside of Planned Parenthood…
http://silentscream.org
Mike
June 25th, 2008 at 9:06 pm
StudentFL,
If I were constantly outside of your house, would you not put up cameras? Again, why the concern if nobody is doing anything wrong?
June 25th, 2008 at 9:42 pm
"It seems to me, furthermore, that if we find it difficult to explain images of abortion to our children we will find it even more difficult to explain why we didn't do more to stop abortion itself. The bottom line is that if graphic images of abortion are too terrible to look at, then the abortions themselves are too terrible to tolerate. We need to expose the injustice, and then direct our displeasure toward those allow the injustice to continue, not toward those who speak against it." Father Frank Provone
June 25th, 2008 at 9:52 pm
"Again, why the concern if nobody is doing anything wrong?"
Nobody is doing anything wrong, so why the cameras?
June 25th, 2008 at 11:21 pm
KarenK,
I'll ask you the same question I asked StudentFL. If I were constantly hanging outside of your house and harassing your visitors, would you not put up cameras?
Also, there are MANY things I don't want to explain to children: graphic war photos, pornography, etc. — not just abortion. It isn't up to you to decide what I talk to my kids about.
June 26th, 2008 at 7:30 am
Student says:
KarenK,
I'll ask you the same question I asked StudentFL. If I were constantly hanging outside of your house and harassing your visitors, would you not put up cameras?
We do not kill unborn babies at my house.
June 26th, 2008 at 7:52 am
"Graphic images of abortion have saved lives. One example is a letter I have from Violet Sherringford of New Jersey, who went to an abortion facility and found pro-life protesters there. "The posters they displayed, though very graphic, did succeed in bringing me back to reality and in conveying the horrible mutilation and dismemberment inflicted on the unborn child…. I decided to have the baby. It was the best decision I ever will make."
We use graphic images to save lives from other kinds of violence - I've seen graphic drawing by first and second graders accompanied by the words "Drugs Kill"." I've seen smashed cars put on public display with the sign, "Drunk Driving Kills." The LA Times 7/8/95 reported an effort at Jefferson High School to stop street violence. Freshmen were shown slide after slide of victims blown apart by bullets. The anti-war movement in America was given momentum in the early '70's by a famous photo of a napalmed girl. Efforts to save the starving have been spurred on by images of malnourished children. The examples can go on and on." Father Frank Provone
June 26th, 2008 at 7:58 am
Glad to hear it, but it doesn't answer my question.
June 26th, 2008 at 8:14 am
VIDEO: American Want to Talk Gas, Not Infanticide
http://www.jillstanek.com/archives/2008/06/american_people.html#comments
Mike
June 26th, 2008 at 8:16 am
Audiotape: Tiller abortionist Shelley Sella stabbed live baby to death
http://www.jillstanek.com/archives/2008/06/35_wk_baby_murd.html#comments
Mike
June 26th, 2008 at 8:28 am
Student, you said: “Glad to hear it, but it doesn't answer my question.”
So, I’ll give you an answer. When you live (reside permanently) at the clinic, then it will be okay for you to setup the security cameras for intimidation.
Student, you said: “Again, why the concern if nobody is doing anything wrong?”
Would you like it if I permanently pointed a large and obtrusive camera at the parking lot and entrance to the clinic? After all, to quote you, “Again, why the concern if nobody is doing anything wrong?” Wouldn’t you call that intimidation? After all, let’s not forget that PP already has cameras that are suitable for security installed on the premises. The security argument is nothing but a red herring. Why install other larger, and more prominent, camera if not to intimidate?
June 26th, 2008 at 9:27 am
This is the first time I saw so many camera's without Jesse Jackson, Father Phleger and Jeremiah Wright around!
Oh Yes, I forgot they are all either for abortion or invite Pro-Abortion speakers to speak at their pulpits.
Mike
June 26th, 2008 at 10:12 am
My office has cameras pointed at the parking lot, the back lot, our docks and our courtyard. Nobody resides or works here 24/7 and nobody seems to have any objections.
Again, why do you care? Seriously, I've yet to hear a valid reason as to why you object so much to the cameras. If you do, in fact, feel intimidated, why do you feel that way?
As I've said repeatedly, my picture and a picture of my license plate is taken almost every time I'm there. What's the difference between that and the security cameras? Why is one acceptable and the other not?
June 26th, 2008 at 12:10 pm
I like those cameras:) in fact I hope they can hear what I am saying, their hearts may be touched, God works in mysterious ways:)
June 26th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
I like those cameras! Keep that film rolling!I wish you
had a sound system so you could hear us. But for now you
can see the many who have their heads bowed praying for the workers, the abortionists, the patients. It was sad
when you wrote that you need the cameras because you feel we may want to "kill" you". No! Don't you know yet what
we want? WE WANT LIFE!
June 26th, 2008 at 1:16 pm
Speaking of Camera's with Sound - Check this out…
http://prolifecorner.com/files/video/Warningkeith.swf
Mike
June 26th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Mike, my fellow pro-life friend sent me that video by e-mail April 11, 08. It is very telling of the evil that is out there.
People listen to that man's vial words, that is not someone who loves God. Can you not see the difference between good and bad anymore?
June 26th, 2008 at 2:05 pm
"StudentFL,
If I were constantly outside of your house, would you not put up cameras? Again, why the concern if nobody is doing anything wrong?"
absolutely! but if you gave me no reason that you would do anything threatening, then those cameras would suffice.
in fact, if i already had cameras on my home, and you had at some point trespassed and the cameras on my house were capable enough to prove to the police that you trespasses, then I would not need to put up bigger ones pointing at you.
if you weren't doing anything wrong, then why would I ever put up more, bigger ones, and broke my own original building plans my making them exposed and in clear daylight pointing at you. (the original cams were smaller and in the security bubbles)
June 26th, 2008 at 2:40 pm
Would the same hold true if I had a family history of violence and murder?
So it's the size of the cameras that offend you?
I've yet to figure out why you (collectively) are so bothered by these new cameras.
The bigger question, in my mind, is why is it ok for you to photograph me and my license plate nearly every time I'm there? What is the purpose behind this if not intimidation?
June 26th, 2008 at 6:06 pm
Student, you said: “My office has cameras pointed at the parking lot, the back lot, our docks and our courtyard. Nobody resides or works here 24/7 and nobody seems to have any objections.”
You said your home, I am just clarifying that you really meant your work.
Student, you said: “Again, why do you care? Seriously, I've yet to hear a valid reason as to why you object so much to the cameras. If you do, in fact, feel intimidated, why do you feel that way?
The reason that I care is because of it’s purpose. There is no need to add the additional cameras, beyond what has already been installed. There is no added security benefit for more. So, let me ask you: What’s the purpose — if not for intimidation?
Student, you said: “As I've said repeatedly, my picture and a picture of my license plate is taken almost every time I'm there. What's the difference between that and the security cameras? Why is one acceptable and the other not?”
Let me try to illustrate this point again. How would you like it if someone were there video tapping the clinic, it’s “clients”, and their cars/license plates? After all, based on your argument, turnabout is fair play, right? The difference here is that one is continuous and the other is not. Are you videotaped by a pro-lifer each time you arrive and leave the clinic? We are by PP!
Student, you said: “Would the same hold true if I had a family history of violence and murder?”
Let me see, since PP has a history of covering up statutory rape, incest, and murdering unborn children in the third trimester then would we be justified in videotaping? After all, one could make the argument that this was simply documentation to be offered up as evidence at a later date to prove a crime (which has been done successfully in the past).
As aside, I condone none of these actions, but just use them as a corollary to Student’s arguments.
June 26th, 2008 at 7:02 pm
I did say my home earlier, but used my work as an example — a more fair example (or so I thought) as both are businesses.
I think they are entitled to install whatever security devices they deem necessary on their property. I have no personal knowledge of their reasoning, but if I were to guess, I would assume they were put there to ensure that the protesters followed the law to the letter.
And, Charles, while I appreciate your taking the time to answer my post, you still did not address this issue.
Charles, my picture is taken (as is a picture of my license) almost every time I'm there. WHY? Can you (or anyone else) answer that for me?
And this makes a difference why? It's ok for you to photograph me and my car but it's not ok for PP to videotape. Are you actually arguing that becuase one is a still photo and one is a videotape there is a difference?
And the PL movement has a history of violence and murder. I can find you links and evidence if you like, but I'm sure you're aware of it.
I'm not sure what it is you don't condone? The use of photography by either side?
June 26th, 2008 at 7:40 pm
I try to look at everything as a positive. Klan Parenthood has the camera's on the Prayer Warriors.
Let's embrace the camera's and teach those watching the camera's how to pray, how to lead, how to be humble, how to be chaste, how to forgive, how to help those in need, how to reach out, how to love all people from the womb to the tomb, how to worship God and not play God, how to sing, how to read and follow scripture, how to be apostles and spread God's Word and how to Love.
Mike
June 26th, 2008 at 8:28 pm
I think the purpose of the cameras is not to intimidate the pro-life counselors. I think they are to give the potential PP customers the impressions that the pro-lifers are not there to help, but to hurt. The purpose it to keep the prospective abortive mothers from talking to the counselors, to fear them, or to have contempt for them. More lies from PP, who is afraid of the truth that pro-life people are simply trying to offer alternatives to abortion to women in a desperate situation.
June 26th, 2008 at 8:53 pm
Student,
I'm sorry if you got the impression that we object to the cameras, that's not the case.
PP can put up cameras wherever they like on their property.
We're just speculating about the reasons why PP put up more cameras.
Clearly, since they're pointed directly at where our sidewalk counselors stand, the counselors are the reason for the cameras.
So we wonder, why train more cameras on our counselors? We know they can see the counselors with their current cameras, so it's not simply to be able to see them.
The only reason that makes sense is that they want to send a message to the counselors.
Let's be honest, they want our counselors gone. One of the best ways to do that is to convince the counselors that it's not safe to do what they do.
Just observing and speculating.
June 27th, 2008 at 11:01 am
I can have the police confiscate the video next time a raged pro-abort swerves there car at me. :<)
June 27th, 2008 at 12:18 pm
Matt,
I would have to agree with you 100% although, to be clear, this is just my personal opinion. Conversely, I think you folks take my picture for exactly the same reason. Am I wrong?
June 27th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
Mike,
It's sad that you have to resort to name calling (Klan Parenthood).It just shows your immaturity.I'm sure GOD would not approve of that sort of behavior.Also that should be considered a personal attack,or is that only reserved for the pro choice?
June 27th, 2008 at 3:04 pm
Truthseeker you do the same (pro-abort)!I am pro choice not pro -abort and I really resent the way you pro lifers act like you are the only ones who have an opinion that matters.That is such a selfish and and selfcentered attitude to take.You have no way of knowing what GOD does or does not approve of so ……..
June 27th, 2008 at 3:07 pm
"THOU SHALL NOT KILL" GOD
June 27th, 2008 at 3:35 pm
Love thy neighbor GOD
June 27th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Love and life go together, remember?
June 27th, 2008 at 4:21 pm
KarenK,
Are you a strict vegan?
June 27th, 2008 at 4:24 pm
Student,
I'll concede for the sake of the debate that someone is intentionally taking your picture when you volunteer, though I'm not sure we can verify anything other than that there were cameras pointed in your general direction.
That said, sure it's for the same reason, but consider our contrasting motivations. I don't want you to volunteer at Planned Parenthood because I don't like Planned Parenthood and I don't think it's good for you, so I want to do what I can to stop you from doing that. Remembering, of course, that I think you're volunteering to help people who are killing babies.
So if I think taking your picture will dissuade you from doing that, you could understand why I might do that.
But why should Planned Parenthood want to intimidate us out of offering women another option in their difficult situation? All we want to do is tell them they have options, emphasize that there are people willing to help them have their baby. That's just another of the acceptable panoply of viewpoints, right?
So there's no reason for PP to try to close out one choice in favor of another, is there? Unless Planned Parenthood isn't quite the haven of objectivity and free choice it claims to be.
The cameras are just one more thing that displays the "choice" Planned Parenthood wants women to make.
June 27th, 2008 at 4:41 pm
Student, I don't have time right now to answer your question, I need to finish eating my buffalo burger.
June 27th, 2008 at 5:02 pm
KarenK,
At least you have a sense of humor! ROTFLMAO
June 27th, 2008 at 5:45 pm
I can verify that you have, in fact, taken my photo. I've seen it in your picture collections.
Then I think it's a bit disingenuous to complain when it happens to you.
Fair enough. In turn, I don't like what you're doing and I don't think it's good for the patients at the clinic. I think you're attempting to make women, in an already incredibly difficult situation, feel even worse.
Many people are dissuaded from volunteering because they are afraid, I'm just not one of them, however, given the above, you can certainly understand why PP has installed their cameras.
Because that is not all you want to do. If I honestly believed that, I would personally send women over to talk to you.
No, it isn't. I have witnessed firsthand a man yelling "baby killer" and "slut" at a young woman entering the clinic. That certainly cannot, by any standard, be considered "helping."
That depends on what you're referring to. I don't consider the name calling to be acceptable.
They don't attempt to close off choices. All options are on the table — they just allow women to make the decision for themselves.
And your cameras are pointed at me in the hope that I will be afraid, that others will be afraid and that you will be able to limit the choice to something YOU deem acceptable. I believe that women are more capable of deciding what's best for them than a group of strangers. JMHO
June 27th, 2008 at 5:54 pm
Be not afraid, love each other, love the born and the unborn. Do everything with kindness and love.I would never try and make a woman in an already difficult situation feel worse. I offer my kindness and understanding and most of all willingness to give her all the support she needs to help her save her baby's life.
June 27th, 2008 at 6:14 pm
The only time I get mad when they take my picture is when they didn't give me a chance to smile:)
June 27th, 2008 at 6:50 pm
VIDEO: If Fatherhood Begins At Conception…
http://www.jillstanek.com/archives/2008/06/obama_if_father.html#comments
Mike
June 27th, 2008 at 7:12 pm
Student,
I guess I would have hoped this would have been clear after all the talking we've done here, but I (and I feel pretty confident I speak for every pro-lifer I know by name)am every bit as much against yelling and name calling as you are. Probably more so because it not only hurts women, it hurts our cause too.
Any pro-lifer who would call a woman a slut has my personal invitation to stay home. That is unkind, inappropriate, and demeaning to a woman who's probably got enough problems as it is.
I know there are pro-lifers who do yell demeaning things, but I have to maintain that the vast majority of pro-lifers would not yell and their blood boils when people do.
I don't know if you've caught wind of the story up in Rockford with the pro-choice fellow who routinely comes around with his big scary dog to harass pro-lifers at the local abortion facility, here's a link to a story with some video.[WARNING: Excessive profanity and racial slurs in the video]
Anyway, I think this debate (by which I mean the entire dialog on life issues) would be helped along greatly if we could both assume that most of our opponents are not vitriolic hate-mongers.
Most of the people who care enough to be actively involved in debate on these issues are compassionate people who genuinely want the best for women in difficult circumstances.
I really think we agree much more than we disagree on this part of the issue.
June 27th, 2008 at 8:45 pm
Am I a strict vegan?Where did that come from?
June 27th, 2008 at 11:39 pm
Kathy, I don't know myself:)LOL
Oh and by the way, I forgot to say thank you for congratulating my daughter on her graduation. She had to work her way through college her last two years. We are proud of her as you can imagine. Peace, Karen
June 28th, 2008 at 8:13 am
That is definately something to be proud of:)
June 28th, 2008 at 8:21 am
I agree with Matt there is NEVER any excuse for calling any woman names, it only hurts the pro-life cause. However, any one who believes that it is better for a woman to have her cervix forcibly opened with dialators, her innocent, pre-born baby tortured, mutilated and ripped apart with a currette and then suctioned out with a cannula is very deceived or very callous to believe that being "pro-choice" shows compassion for her or her baby. I have been a health care worker and an educator for years so I know this is an extremely bloody procedure.
It is like being "pro-choice" about the Nazi death camps or KKK lynchings. In Hitler's Germany people stood by and said it was better for those he exterminated to DIE because they were parasites and undesirable, Margaret Sanger called them the "unfit". In America we are schizophrenic today because we call murder of the most innocent among us "a choice" but it's a blessing when the "baby" is "planned and wanted", of course this decision is made by people who have already been born (how convienent for them). This entire country is mostly populated by those who were unwanted at some point in their history, those who willingly came or fled here such as ex-immigrants or ex-refuges and former slaves (who were forcibly brought to this country and thought not even human by their captors). All of these people are considered worthy of human dignity, respect, and the right to LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS today except the unborn. What a sick society we live in. Today the most dangerous place for a baby, especially an African American baby is in it's mother's womb. Margaret Sanger's dream has come true. Silence is indeed consent like it was in Hitler's Germany.
We devalue human beings especially teens by promoting sexually, promiscuous behavior, telling them they can have "safe sex" and WHEN it fails devalue human life more by encouraging young women to get rid of the consequences by killing their unborn because it's their "right to choose". Did I mention that PP makes billions off of this whole scenario? All of the physical, emotional, mental, social, and spiritual carnage that is left behind has cost us much more than the billions of dollars PP has made in profit. I have seen it with the thousands of teens and young people I have worked with over the years, who want someone to tell them how valuable their bodies, hearts and minds are.
June 28th, 2008 at 1:07 pm
Dear Educator, Thank you for your wonderful words of truth and logic!! God bless you and keep educating us! I encourage all to open their minds and hearts to reconsider your viewpoints. This is not a competition on who can win an agrument; it is about life and death. We as humans should learn from our past, not repeat the same evils. Please re-read Educators link and this time with an open heart, mind and soul.
June 28th, 2008 at 1:39 pm
WOW!That was very moving an has made a better point than the pictures.I will possibly think differently now.You have a way with words educator!Thank you!!:)
June 28th, 2008 at 3:34 pm
God Bless you Kathy, Reading what you wrote to educator makes my heart sing.
June 28th, 2008 at 4:19 pm
Praise you Educator…and may our Precious Lord Jesus continue to work through you.
June 28th, 2008 at 4:49 pm
Please take my picture every time! I hope you see compassion in my face. I hope you hear love in my voice as you escort the ladies to the door. This is Pro-Life/Aurora and our history is today! We are peaceful. We are prayful. We are concerned about what is happening in our neighborhood. We care about the hurting women and that is why we are here for LIFE.
June 28th, 2008 at 8:51 pm
I just got home from work and while I was there I couldn't get Educators words out of my head.It has really affected me in a positive way.I wold really like to speak more at length with someone like you Karen.
June 28th, 2008 at 11:21 pm
Somebody asked me a question that I honestly didn't know the answer so I am throwing this out. I know there is a decent amount of talk about adoption. I know a couple that is willing to pay all medical and legal bills to adopt a child. Is there an organization they can reach out to? I have no idea and that is why I am asking. They are in the DC area.
June 28th, 2008 at 11:51 pm
Kathy, I would like very much to talk with you more. Kathy could you please, and everyone reading this, please pray for my daughter, the one I told you about who just graduated, I just came back from the hospital where she was taken to emergency at around 4;30 on Saturday. I am home to get some things before I go back. She has some very serious infection in her ovary area. She got sick so fast and was about to pass out and was doubled over in terrible pain.She has a high fever, they gave her morphene and other drugs. She is still in great pain.They are still doing tests. Please pray for her. She is one of the kindest, most caring, loving, do anything for anyone person I have ever known. Please pray, God bless, Karen
June 29th, 2008 at 2:52 am
Yes, Karen, I am praying that your daughter will be made well by God's mercy to us. What just occurred to me is whether this request came from a Pro-Choice person for their daughter or from a Pro-Life person for their daughter each of us would be praying very hard for that young lady to be made well and that is because we are not words but we are for LIFE. God bless, Margo
June 29th, 2008 at 9:39 am
Karen,
I will pray for your daughter to get well but I'm sure that your faith will be the strongest support of all.
Margo,
Why does it matter who asked (pro-life or pro-choice).Isn't everyone important enough to pray for?
June 29th, 2008 at 10:36 am
Karen,
please keep me updated on your daughters progress as I have a tendancy to be a worry-wart.God bless you and yours.
June 29th, 2008 at 10:39 am
NEW ONLINE VIDEO: Jason Evert Speaks About "Romance Without Regret" to College Students. This is a MUST SEE ONLINE VIDEO! Here's the link…
http://www.pureloveclub.com/seminars/index.php?id=5
Mike
June 29th, 2008 at 12:59 pm
Karen K I will pray for your daughter as well and for you also, I know how difficult it is for a family member to stand by while your loved one is suffering in pain. May God bless your daughter and the resolution to her illness come quickly. I will pray for her healthcare providers to have wisdom and to give compassionate care to her as well.
Kathy,I am humbled and blessed that some words I posted touched your heart. I will pray for you as well. Please do not take offense about Margo's surprize that pro-life and pro-choice people are both praying for Karen's daughter. I think that many pro-choice people have expressed in their posts that they do not believe in God or his principles, and have expressed that they think that prayer and faith in God is stupid. I think it is also hard for some of us pro-lifers to believe that someone who feels it is "a women's right to choose" to kill her unborn baby would believe in God Almighty who is the creator of all life, planned or unplanned. Do you understand what I mean, if you read back on some of the pro-choicers posts they express a disdain for God.
June 29th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Educator,
Even though I have no belief in God, I do not wish harm to KarenK's daughter. It is very difficult to deal with the illness of one's child. I've been there. And while I do not pray, she is in my thoughts.
June 29th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
You are right Educator,but I have alot of faith in GOD and believe in him wholeheartedly.I believe that is why your words were written for me to read.HE sent them through you!
June 29th, 2008 at 11:10 pm
I appreciate Student your good thoughts for Karen's daughter and I am sure she does also. I am not implying that pro-choicers wish ill will on pro-lifers on a personal level. However, it is difficult during heated discussions to discern where a person who denies God and his principles is coming from, especially when discussing "the right to life", as a pro-lifer who believes that God is the very Creator of life.
I think that in previous post both of our sides may have said some unkind things toward each other, but as your post and Kathy's shows we all have families and loved ones who we are glad were given "the gift of life". Our vantage point is different though, while pro-lifers believe each of our loved ones (and every human being) have a God given gift of "the right to LIFE, liberty… " whether they were "planned or unplanned", from my understanding of your vantage point their lives should have been based on "their mother's right to choose" depending on the mother's circumstances. I will pray for you and other pro-choicers too.
June 29th, 2008 at 11:12 pm
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for all of your prayers and "thoughts" for a good outcome for my daughter. It warms my heart to know you good people have so much love to share, and in some cases with a stranger. But we are not really strangers are we? We are brother and sisters in Christ! My daughter is not any better, but not ant worse. She still has a great deal of pain, and fever. We are worried about this infection because it has not yet responded to an IV course of powerful antibiotics. If by Wednesday morning her fever does not break she will have to have surgery. Please keep praying, and I will offer my sufferings of exhaustion and uncertainty for all of you, and especially for those who need the grace to see the sanctity of all life. I was praying in the hospital room, and then said Liese,(Leeza) you pray with me, she tried but was too sick, so I said, don't worry,(I always talk to her about this site where we all talk), I believe you have some wonderful prayers being offered for you already, she smiled weakly and said, tell them thank you.
Jesus I trust in You. Peace, Karen
June 30th, 2008 at 1:57 am
I need to clarify my post. When I said that each of us would be praying for Karen's daughter, I met it to be Pro-Life people who believe in God. And that these people who believe in God would be the people who would pray very hard for a pro-life person or a pro-choice person. It would not make any difference. I was sad at the misunderstanding. I continue to pray for Karen's daughter.
P.S. Even if you did not believe in God- a pro-choice person and you needed help–I would help you in any way that you would need and that is what LIFE is doing.
June 30th, 2008 at 8:45 am
Dear Margo, I knew what you meant, don't be sad. I am going back now to the hospital, know that I am so very grateful for all the kind words, from both sides of the issue. "We are all in this together", and the love of Our Lord will sustain us and get us through anything. All we have to do is say, Yes, Lord, strenghthen my belief, Lord, or in many cases, help my unbelief. Thank you Kathy, for your prayers. Your prayers are so precious to Jesus right now, because you have opened your eyes and heart and are starting to see Him. Don't worry, St. Padre Pio said, that worry is useless,and trust in the Lord. God bless, Karen
June 30th, 2008 at 8:56 am
The person who posted at 11:51 and asked about the possible adoption. Although pregnancy care centers like the Pregnancy Information Center of Fox Valley in Aurora can NOT use their facility to arrange any adoptions, they may be able to give you the names of some organizations that can help your friends in the D.C. area. So many people don't know about the possiblility of open adoptions where a birth mom and the adoptive family can stipulate ways for the birth mom to still have some contact with her child. PIC is in the Yellow pages of the phone book under Abortion Alternatives.
June 30th, 2008 at 1:29 pm
Thank you Educator.
June 30th, 2008 at 2:49 pm
RADIO INTERVIEW (6/30/08): Stanek on Bennett (Born Alive Infants Protection Act)
http://www.jillstanek.com/archives/2008/06/stanek_on_benne.html#comments
Mike
June 30th, 2008 at 8:07 pm
Thank you again for your prayers. Liese still has a fever but is doing better. When I was at the hospital today, my daughter unfortunately had an allergic reaction to an anti-nauseous medication. She is ok now. But I wanted to share this, that when we rang for the nurse, it was taking long for her to come. Liese was scaring me because she was having hard time breathing and was really dizzy, so I went out in the hall to find a nurse. I found Liese's nurse in another patient’s room. The nurse came and helped Liese, and she was alright. But what I wanted to say was, when I went near the other patients room, there I saw a very old man lying in his bed, so tiny, frail and helpless. The room almost seemed to glow white and this man looked angelic as he slept. Liese had to be put in the cancer ward probably because of lack of availability elsewhere. It just struck me somehow, as the nurse tenderly cared for this man how precious and sacred life is from the moment of conception, when we are so very tiny and helpless, to when we are very old and again become so helpless and vulnerable. These times in our existence are times for the rest of the world to embrace the dignity of all life.
I would do anything to take Liese's place for her. But I know God is allowing this suffering for her for a greater good. This is part of the mystery of suffering. Somewhere someone is benefitting by her sufferings. I find that to be so beautiful.
June 30th, 2008 at 11:58 pm
I believe you really do feel this way but, unfortunately, you obviously can't control everyone.
My personal experience also bears this out as well. However, there always seem to be a few who do yell. It only takes one nut for violence to occur. That, in my opinion, is why the cameras are there.
I'm opposed to the idiocy on both sides. I think you've seen me call out a PCer on the name calling a time or two. However, it appears that this guy thinks the protesters are there "harassing" women. Having said that, please be clear that I am not condoning his conduct (or that of the protesters).
I agree with you on this.
July 1st, 2008 at 7:42 am
KarenK,
For the life of me I just don't understand this. Would you explain? I'm not trying to be rude, I would sincerely like to understand where you're coming from and why you believe this. I just don't get it at all.
As an aside, I'm happy to hear your daughter is doing better.
July 1st, 2008 at 7:44 am
Dear Student, Thank you for your kind words. I sorry but I am so tired, sleeping in a chair these past nights and all. Well, I thought I would hope that these words might help you understand the value in suffering. When I can think better I will write more about it. Redemptive suffering is a difficult concept to understand, but I also just heard something that might explain why we have such a hard time with believing and understanding, "What is revealed to the simple is not always revealed to the clever."
Thank you again, Karen
Excerpts from HEALING POWER OF SUFFERING
Mother M. Angelica
——————————————————————————–
From the time of Adam and Eve, man has tried to escape suffering in any form. It is a mystery to all except the holy ones of God. The Prophets saw it as a call from God to repent. The Apostles saw it as "a happy privilege" to imitate Jesus. Pagans saw it as foolishness. Men of today see it as an evil and try to avoid it, but it follows them wherever they go.
The Father chose suffering for His Son from His birth to His death and Jesus reminded us that the servant is not above the master. If He, as God-Man had to "suffer in order to enter into Glory," then we too must suffer in order to prepare ourselves for glory.
God is Love and He wants to share Himself with us here and in eternity, but the cravings of our nature, the lure of riches, and the temptations of the Enemy all combine to distract, dissuade and discourage us from our goal. The sufferings of this life not only make our temperament more like the Divine Personality of Jesus, but detach us from the things of this world. This Divine preparation opens our souls to the working and pruning of the Father.
Our degree of glory and our capacity for love for all eternity will depend upon our grace at the moment of our death.
Redemptive Suffering
The word "redeem" means to rescue, set free, ransom, and to pay the penalty incurred by another. We often lose sight of the definition to "set free," and miss the power of our example as Christians to do exactly that-set our neighbor free.
St. Paul did not want the sufferings encountered by being a Christian to discourage or dishearten anyone. He realized that when the Christian saw the blessings and grace that poured upon him after his trials, he would gain courage to suffer in his turn.
Whatever we do to our neighbor, we do to Jesus and all the sufferings our neighbor encounters in his daily life help to build up the Mystical Body of Christ.
What is the purpose of all this suffering for others? "It is all to bind you together in love," says St. Paul, "and to stir your minds, so that your understanding may come to full development" (Col. 2:2).
Witness Suffering
"We prove we are servants of God by great fortitude in times of suffering."(2 Cor. 6:4-10) To see a Christian believe in God's Love when sorrow befalls him gives Hope.
To see joy on the face of a Christian beset with trials and problems, gives us a new concept of Faith.
To see someone crushed but serene over the death of a loved one, makes us realize there is another life.
To see sickness and pain patiently borne gives us courage.
To see a friend who has suffered the loss of all things begin again with trust and love, gives us strength to continue on.
To see forgiveness and mercy after friends quarrel, brings joy to our hearts.
To see sinners turn to God and rise to great heights of sanctity, increases our trust in His Love and Mercy.
No matter what kind or what degree of pain and sorrow we must endure, we are capable of witnessing to the love of Jesus.
The very fruit the Spirit bears in us calls for Suffering. St. Paul says the fruit of the Spirit is love, but it is not always easy to love. Our love must extend itself to the unlovable. We are to be joyful, but we must be detached and possess a great trust in God to maintain joy.
July 1st, 2008 at 10:05 pm
More to read:
Whenever we suffer without love it is wasted pain.
Jesus And Suffering
Jesus knew that once He, the Son of the Father, was stretched out on the Cross, all men of faith would obtain the strength to endure the sufferings the Father permitted in their lives.
Jesus knew suffering would not pass from any of us after His Resurrection and He made sure we understood its role in our lives. Throughout the Gospels He promises us suffering and persecution and asks that we accept it with Joy.
He called all those who suffer "blessed" when they overcame their natural weaknesses. He promised Heaven to those who suffered interior and exterior poverty. To those who preferred God to themselves He promised Union with the Father. To those who put their feelings and resentments aside and forgave, He promised Mercy. To those who struggled to maintain peace, He promised sonship. And to those who suffered because they loved Him, He promised Joy.
Before all these fruits would be manifested. some kind of suffering was necessary. His own suffering would have been powerful enough to destroy suffering from the face of the earth, but He did not choose this course. He preferred to continue permitting suffering and make Himself the example for all men to follow.
July 1st, 2008 at 10:58 pm
KarenK,
Thanks for your post. I have to admit, I still don't understand, however, I don't think this is the appropriate time to question this with you.
Is your daughter doing better? Please don't forget to take care of yourself too. Oftentimes when our children are ill we forget to do this.
July 2nd, 2008 at 7:28 am
Student,
If you're willing to put a little time in, I'm putting a link below to Pope John Paul II's Apostolic Letter Salvifici Doloris on the meaning of human suffering. It gets at a lot of the same concepts Karen's quotes were getting at, just in a whole lot of depth.
http://tinyurl.com/3acxq
July 2nd, 2008 at 9:55 am
Is your daughter doing better? Please don't forget to take care of yourself too. Oftentimes when our children are ill we forget to do this.
July 2nd, 2008 at 7:28 am
Dear Student,
Thank you for your concern. You are right about forgetting to take care of ourselves. But I am sure you know that a loving mother, when her child is very sick or in danger, zeros in on that child as if nothing else in the whole world exists, until that child is well or safe. I have been fortunate most of the time in that when my kids were very sick, I was able to care for them and not get sick with them. Only one time can I remember being really sick with them. It was the vomiting flu and it was TERRIBLE! I remember my husband coming home from work and all my kids, 6 of them (some were teenagers) and I were on the floor in the family room in front of the fireplace moaning and groaning. I always seem to react to stress with a sense of humor. I think it is my coping mechanism. Well, when he walked in on this pathetic scene, I said where's Dr. Kevorkian when you need him?LOL (of course you know I am kidding)
Liese is doing better!! She is home out of the hospital! She has to take two weeks of a strong antibiotic. I pray she continues to get well. Thank you to all who prayed for her, and showed concern.
"KarenK,
Thanks for your post. I have to admit, I still don't understand, however, I don't think this is the appropriate time to question this with you."
Dear student, I hope I can help you understand. The ability to offer up one's suffering, and present it to Our Lord, is just that, a gift. But God does not need anything, so that gift is really for all of us. He can reflect it back, like a mirror, to us or to someone who needs special graces and blessings. But first that offering must be given to our Lord, and then He in turn transforms it back to us. "It is all to bind you together in love," says St. Paul, Whenever we suffer without love it is wasted.
Bishop Sheen once said that our hospitals are full of suffering, treasure loads to be offered to Our Lord. If people could only realize this. All we need to do is offer it. There is meaning in suffering, it has redemptive value. Jesus himself showed us this by His own suffering on the cross.
Also, Mary has said at some of the apparitions that people do not ask for graces. That there are so many graces to be bestowed on God's people, but they do not ask. Graces to believe, graces to better understand, graces to get through a difficult time, graces to do the right thing according to the Will of God. It is a mystery how God can do this, but it really makes sense, because God is gentle, and will not force anyone to love Him, if he did that would be taking our free will away from us; we need to ask. Hope this helped. karen
July 2nd, 2008 at 11:01 pm
Dear student, I have great admiration for Bishop Sheen, maybe you could watch some of these videos, also Father Corapi explains things very well also.
YouTube - Bishop Fulton Sheen- His Last Words Part III
July 2nd, 2008 at 11:19 pm
So happy to hear that your daughter is doing better!!Thank GOD!!!!I lost a daughter and for the last several weeks she's been st te front of my mind.Knowing your daughter is better is a real relief.
July 3rd, 2008 at 11:15 am
Dear Kathy, I am heartfelt sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine the pain.I am sorry to have rekindled that pain, if that is the case. You most certainly are in my deepest prayers! I do believe the pain of losing a child has to be the apsolute worst. May our dear Jesus continue to comfort you and wrap His merciful arms around you Kathy.
Please may I ask you to continue to pray for Liese, she is still having some dicomfort and we are a little concerned the antibiotic is not doing its job. God bless you and your family. Karen
All life is precious, all our children, in the womb and out!
July 3rd, 2008 at 6:15 pm
Independence Day Prayer
——————————————————————————–
God our Father, your Son Jesus spoke to us a message
of peace and taught us to live as brothers and sisters.
His message took form in the vision of our Founding Fathers, as they
fashioned a nation where all people might live as one.
This message lives on in our midst as a task for us today
and a promise for tomorrow.
We thank you, Father, for your blessings in the past,
and for all that, with your help, we must yet achieve.
Bless our nation and bless each of us. As we celebrate our independence, may we extend its blessings to our youngest brothers and sisters, the children in the womb.
Hasten the day when our nation will be a nation with liberty and justice,
not just for some, but for all, through Christ our Lord. Amen.
Priests for Life
July 3rd, 2008 at 9:09 pm
[I]t is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. -John Adams
[N]either the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt. -Samuel Adams
I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the Sacred Writings, that "except the Lord build the House, they labor in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without His concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better, than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a reproach and bye word down to future ages. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing governments by human wisdom and leave it to chance, war and conquest.
I therefore beg leave to move that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the clergy of this city be requested to officiate in that service. - Benjamin Franklin
To the kindly influence of Christianity we owe that degree of civil freedom, and political and social happiness which mankind now enjoys. . . . Whenever the pillars of Christianity shall be overthrown, our present republican forms of government, and all blessings which flow from them, must fall with them. -Jedidiah Morse
July 3rd, 2008 at 9:21 pm
VIDEO "FACE THE TRUTH"
http://prolifeaction.org/truth/index.htm
Mike
July 4th, 2008 at 1:09 pm
To "Kathy", in post No. 19:
When someone else's life is threatened, it is all of our business. The deliberate "choice" to kill another human being is not the same as choosing what book to read, or what to eat.
The so-called "choice" to end the life of another human being is a moral choice. The first purpose of government is to protect the lives of its citizens. The taking of an innocent human life is wrong.
There are moral absolutes. Murder, the deliberate taking of an innocent human life is always morally wrong.
A baby in its mother's womb is innocent and defenseless.
To deliberately take the life of baby is always wrong, no matter how young the baby may be or what stage of development it's in. It is always murder.
No matter how you may try to skew the argument, and play around with the language, abortion is always morally wrong. It's always murder of an innocent human being.
I don't have the right to murder you. Why then should you or anyone have the right to murder an innocent baby in its mother's womb?
July 22nd, 2008 at 3:17 am